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- I do. - Do you wish to talk to us at this time?
I do.
So let's start from the beginning. You went in the bathroom.
I went in the bathroom. I got in a stall, sat down.
Your foot came towards mine, mine came towards yours.
Was that natural? I don't know.
Did we bump? Yes, I think we did.
The next thing I knew,
under the bathroom divider
comes a card that says "Police."
- What about your hand? - What about my hand?
I could see the gold wedding ring. I could see that.
Have you been successful in these bathrooms here before?
No, absolutely not.
I don't seek activity in bathrooms.
You're not being truthful to me. I'm kind of disappointed
in you, Senator. I'm real disappointed right now.
Sir, we deal with people that lie to us every day.
- Gentlemen, so do I. - I'm sure you do.
I've never had to bring anybody to jail
because everybody's been truthful to me.
I don't want you to take me to jail.
I'm not gonna take you to jail
as long as you're being cooperative. People vote for you.
I'm a respectable person and I don't do these kinds of--
Where's your respect right now though?
I-I-- I am not gay. I don't do these kinds of things.
- I saw-- - I don't do those things.
AT ITS FUNDAMENTAL CORE, AT ITS BASE,
IT IS SO PROFOUNDLY UNHEALTHY.
BECAUSE IT GOES BACK TO THAT SIMPLE MANIFESTATION,
THAT SIMPLE SHAKESPEAREAN QUOTE:
"UNTO THINE OWN SELF BE TRUE."
YOU HAVE TO BE TRUE TO YOURSELF.
AND THEN, GOD WILLING, TRUE TO YOUR LOVED ONES,
TO YOUR COMMUNITY, TO YOUR PUBLIC.
...turning out at Washington, DC, where the report
of the arrest of Senator Larry Craig
is generating a massive media frenzy.
Breaking tonight, a Republican senator busted by police.
Craig's arrest was first reported about 24 hours or so ago.
A day later "The Idaho Statesman"
published the story it had been holding.
Republican Senator Larry Craig from Idaho
again will be having a news conference in 45 minutes.
Thank you all very much for coming out today.
First, please let me apologize
to my family, friends and staff
and fellow Idahoans for the cloud placed over Idaho.
Senator, what happened in Minneapolis?
Hey, what if you are gay?
Come out of the closet.
It's all right, man. Come on, Larry. Be gay!
I THINK IT'S VERY SAD.
THIS IS SOMEBODY WHO HAS LIVED IN THE CLOSET HIS WHOLE LIFE,
HAS PROBABLY CHEATED ON HIS WIFE ANY NUMBER OF TIMES.
IT'S A TWISTED KIND OF
PSYCHOLOGICAL THING THAT HAPPENS.
WHEN YOU'RE IN THE CLOSET AND LIVING A DOUBLE LIFE,
IT MAKES YOU DO CRAZY THINGS.
AND FOR A UNITED STATES SENATOR
TO BE SOLICITING SEX IN A PUBLIC RESTROOM
IS A CRAZY THING.
TO UNDERSTAND HIS STORY AND ALL OF THESE STORIES,
YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND WHERE THE CULTURE WAS.
IN 1955, MY NEWSPAPER REPORTED
ON A GAY SEX SCANDAL
INVOLVING ALLEGEDLY UNDERAGE MEN
AND POWERFUL PEOPLE IN BOISE.
AMONG THE HEADLINES ON OUR EDITORIAL PAGE
WAS ONE THAT READ "CRUSH THE MONSTER,"
THE MONSTER BEING HOMOSEXUAL PERVERSITY.
THAT WAS 1955. LARRY CRAIG WAS 10 YEARS OLD.
AND I IMAGINE HIM THINKING THAT
THAT WAS AN ABJECT LESSON THAT HE NEEDED TO HEED,
THAT HE COULDN'T ASPIRE TO BE A UNITED STATES SENATOR
AND BE GAY AT THE SAME TIME.
EVERY TIME HE WAS UP FOR ELECTION,
THE QUESTION WAS RAISED--
WILL SOMEONE RAISE THE ISSUE?
Good evening. The Capitol Hill investigation
of sex and drugs which had existed mainly
in the congressional rumor mill
today took on the attributes of a serious and spreading scandal.
The FBI formed a special squad
to investigate allegations of homosexual activity
between congressmen and teenage pages.
One congressman came forward after rumors surfaced
that he was involved in the case.
I have always been aggressive and upfront with what I believe in.
And when I have people telling me
that a whole series of false accusations
are made against my character,
frankly, it makes me mad as hell.
MANY OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE GAY
WHO ARE IN PUBLIC SERVICE SEEM TO THINK
THAT THEY'RE IMMUNE FROM BEING EXPOSED.
AND THEY GO OUT. THEY GO TO BARS.
THEY GO TO CLUBS. THEY EVEN GO TO BATHHOUSES.
WHEN I WAS REALLY YOUNG IN D.C. BACK IN THE '80s,
ONE OF MY FAVORITE PLACES TO GO BACK THEN
WAS "THE FOLLIES."
THERE WERE A NUMBER OF MEN I SAW THERE FROM TIME TO TIME
AND HE WAS ONE OF THOSE.
HE HAD TAKEN NOTICE OF ME
AND THEN HE SAID, "LET'S GO SOMEWHERE ELSE"
AND I PROCEEDED TO FOLLOW HIM
TO HIS HOUSE ON CAPITOL HILL.
THERE WERE PICTURES OF FAMILY AROUND
AND A CARD THAT WAS ADDRESSED TO SUZANNE CRAIG.
WE THEN WOUND UP PERFORMING ORAL SEX ON EACH OTHER
AND THEN HE WANTED TO FUCK ME.
ONCE HE HAD COME,
IT WAS EVERYTHING TO GET ME BACK OUT OF THERE.
HE GRABBED ME BY THE SHOULDER AND VERY BOLDLY SAID,
"REMEMBER, YOU NEVER SAW ME.
YOU'VE NEVER BEEN HERE."
AND HE REACHED INTO HIS POCKET,
TOOK OUT A $20 BILL,
SHOVED IT IN MY BACK POCKET WITH ONE FINGER
AND SAID, "JUST REMEMBER,
I CAN BUY AND SELL YOUR ASS 1,000 TIMES."
Let me be clear: I am not gay.
I never have been gay.
IT'S VERY OFTEN THOSE SELF-HATING GAY PEOPLE WHO,
IN THE CLOSET, ARE THE MOST VICIOUS
TOWARDS OTHER GAYS AND LESBIANS
AS A WAY TO KIND OF DEFLECT ATTENTION
FROM THEIR OWN ORIENTATION.
THERE IS NOT ONE CIVIL RIGHTS LAW
AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL THAT EXISTS
TO PROTECT GAY, LESBIAN, BISEXUAL
OR TRANSGENDER PEOPLE.
THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOT ONE LAW.
THE FACT THAT SENATOR CRAIG AND THOSE LIKE HIM
CAN ENGAGE IN HOMOSEXUAL ACTIVITY ONE MINUTE
AND THEN TRY TO WRITE US OUT OF EXISTENCE THE NEXT--
THERE IS NO PUNISHMENT HARSH ENOUGH AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED.
He was a powerful force on senate committees,
a solid family-values conservative.
The American people already know
that Bill Clinton is a bad boy,
a naughty boy. I'm going to speak out
for the citizens of my state who,
in the majority, think that Bill Clinton
is probably even a nasty bad naughty boy.
But in October 2006,
eight months before the senator's arrest in Minneapolis,
a gay activist named Michael Rogers
who makes it his business to out conservative politicians
wrote in his blog that he'd interviewed several men
who'd claimed to have had sex with Senator Larry Craig.
IN OCTOBER OF '06 I OUTED LARRY CRAIG.
I KNOW SOMEBODY WHO HAD SEX WITH LARRY CRAIG IN A RESTROOM AT UNION STATION.
THAT, TO ME, IS THE CRUX OF THE CASE RIGHT THERE.
RIGHT NOW I HAVE A NUMBER OF OPEN FILES
OF FOLKS THAT I'M ACTIVELY LOOKING AT,
FROM A U.S. CABINET OFFICIAL
TO OFFICES OF SOME PRETTY ANTIGAY MEMBERS OF CONGRESS.
SO I'M HERE. I'M GETTING READY
TO GO ON "HANNITY & COLMES" TONIGHT AT 9:00.
DAVID'S WITH ME, HELPING ME OUT ON SOME OF MY TALKING POINTS.
- SAY HI, DAVID. - HELLO.
CAN'T LET THE RIGHT WING BE THE ONLY ONES WITH THE FLAG.
I ACTUALLY ONCE HAD SOMEBODY ASK ME ON FOX NEWS,
"ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO WEAR THAT FLAG?" "YEAH, I AM."
SO, DAVID, WHY DON'T YOU FIRE ME A FEW QUESTIONS
LIKE HOW HANNITY'S GOING TO DO THAT, YOU KNOW?
"MIKE, HOW IS WHAT YOU'RE DOING DIFFERENT THAN McCARTHYISM?"
- THIS IS McCARTHYISM!" - FIRST OF ALL,
SEAN, McCARTHY WAS A LIAR.
McCARTHY PUT OUT FALSE INFORMATION
- ABOUT AMERICANS. - OH NO!
THAT'S JUST THE SAUCE. I'M GONNA HAVE TO CUT YOU OFF RIGHT THERE.
- MIKE-- MIKE-- MIKE-- - SEAN-- SEAN-- SEAN--
- WE'RE OUTTA TIME. - THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS. THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS.
YOUR MOUTH WILL OPEN, BUT NOTHING WILL COME OUT OF IT.
Breaking news tonight. Fox News has confirmed
that Senator Larry Craig may be reconsidering his decision to resign.
Joining us now with reaction to this story
is blogger Mike Rogers, who called for an investigation
into Craig last year. All right, from the beginning.
HI, SEAN, AND GOOD EVENING. THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME ON.
Larry Craig is a hypocrite.
He is an antigay closeted individual who has sex with other men.
I read what you had and apparently this tape of this one guy
that "The Idaho Statesman" followed up on.
- It was a-- wait, hang on a second. - It's not one guy, Sean.
It was an anonymous source-- why doesn't the guy go on the record?
Sean, it's not one guy. It's now three or four.
THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT IN MY MIND.
I HAVE HEARD PHYSICAL CHARACTERISTICS REPEATED TO ME FROM VARIOUS INDIVIDUALS.
I don't know about Senator Craig. I'm going to be honest,
- I don't have the details. There is suspicion-- - I DO, I DO.
Are there others in the same category as Larry Craig
who you think whose names will be forthcoming
because of your work?
ABSOLUTELY. THERE ARE NAMES OF THE FOLKS IN CONGRESS
IN HIGH POSITIONS OF POWER WHO ARE LEADING A SECRET DOUBLE LIFE.
And what I would say to Sean is, Sean, where do you stand with Larry Craig?
And will you stand in the same position
if other two-lived hypocrites
ARE EXPOSED? BECAUSE I CAN ASSURE YOU
THAT THERE IS NO SHORTAGE.
MY FIRST VERY BIG CASE WAS THIS CONGRESSMAN
IN VIRGINIA BY THE NAME OF ED SCHROCK.
A MONTH LATER, I GOT A TIP
THAT THERE WAS A CONGRESSMAN WHO WAS GAY
AND THAT HE WAS USING AN INTERACTIVE PHONE DATING SERVICE
TO FIND WHAT MAY BE KNOWN AS INSTA-SEX,
OR, YOU KNOW, TO HOOK UP WITH SOMEBODY FOR SEX.
AND THE FIRST THING I SAID TO THE PERSON WAS, "THIS IS INSANE.
I CAN'T PUT UP THAT A CONGRESSMAN
IS USING AN INTERACTIVE PHONE SERVICE WITHOUT PROOF.
I MEAN, THAT'S A HELL OF A CHARGE TO LEVY."
AND HE SAYS, "I HAVE SEVERAL RECORDINGS OF THE CONGRESSMAN
GOING ON THE PHONE LINE TO MEET A MAN FOR SEX.
AND THEY'RE VERY EXPLICIT." AND I WAS LIKE, WOW!
SO I TOOK THE RECORDINGS AND WENT AHEAD
AND REPORTED ON ED SCHROCK ON MY BLOG.
A case of the moral hunter becoming the moral hunted.
Congressman Edward Schrock, a Virginia Republican
who once co-sponsored a bill to ban same-sex marriage,
dropped out of his bid for re-election last month.
HE NEVER ADMITTED THAT THEY WERE HIM,
BUT HE RESIGNED FROM HIS RE-ELECTION.
THERE IT IS.
I AM GOING TO TELL PEOPLE WHO THESE HORRIBLE TRAITORS ARE.
AND THEY ARE TRAITORS TO THEIR PEOPLE. I BELIEVE THAT.
AND I FELT THAT IT WAS TIME
FOR ME TO START REPORTING THAT AS HYPOCRISY.
NOT OUTING PEOPLE WHO ARE GAY,
BUT REPORTING ON INDIVIDUALS
WHO ARE WORKING AGAINST THE COMMUNITY
THAT THEY THEN EXPECT TO PROTECT THEM.
BE WAITING IN FRONT OF 1600 BROADWAY. THAT'S PERFECT.
MICHAEL HAS DECIDED THAT THEY HAVE BEEN
CHASING US FOR YEARS.
AND WHAT MICHAEL REPRESENTS IS, "WE'RE GONNA CHASE BACK."
NOW THAT UPSETS THE RULES
BECAUSE EVERYONE KNOWS THE HOUNDS CHASE THE FOXES.
WELL, THIS FOX IS CHASING THE HOUNDS.
AND IT'S GOT THEM ALL BENT OUT OF SHAPE.
AND I SAY MORE POWER TO HIM.
I THINK OUTING
IS A...
FUNDAMENTALLY WRONG
AND DISHONEST THING TO DO.
NO ONE CAN EVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
THE PERSONAL JOURNEY THAT AN INDIVIDUAL TAKES
TO ACCEPTING THE FACT THAT THEY ARE GAY OR LESBIAN.
I JUST FEEL SYMPATHY WHEN THEY ARE EXPOSED THAT WAY.
I THINK EVERY GAY PERSON KNOWS WHAT IT'S LIKE
TO HAVE YOUR PRIVACY RIPPED APART.
THERE IS A RIGHT TO PRIVACY, BUT NOT A RIGHT TO HYPOCRISY.
IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT THE PEOPLE WHO MAKE THE LAW
BE SUBJECT TO THE LAW.
PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT SUBJECT TO LAWS WILL MAKE HARSH LAWS
BECAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE TO LIVE WITH THEM.
HAVING THE PEOPLE WHO MAKE THE LAW
BE FULLY COVERED BY THE LAW
IS A SAFEGUARD AGAINST UNFAIRNESS.
THAT'S A FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLE ON WHICH OUR DEMOCRACY IS IN PART BUILT
THAT GAY PEOPLE WHO SUPPORT HOMOPHOBIA ARE VIOLATING.
And now to Campaign 2006.
He's been the state's attorney general and education commissioner and on Tuesday,
Charlie Crist hopes to be elected governor.
Charlie Crist--
50, single, no kids, doesn't own a home,
wants to live in the governor's mansion.
I'm a consistent conservative.
I can continue to stand for the things that I believe in.
At a stop in Miami, the tone was urgent.
I need you to get it out there. I need your vote.
I need your heart. I need your passion.
Get out there, get it done.
Viva Crist. Let's win. God bless you.
I believe that marriage is a sacred relationship
between a man and a woman.
I've always felt that way and I still believe that now.
Marriage is a relationship like my mother and father had,
like I had before I got divorced.
It is one of those unique institutions--
not only in America, but across the world--
where a man and a woman commit to one another.
Please leave a message.
HI, BRUCE. THIS IS BOB NORMAN WITH "NEW TIMES."
I AM A JOURNALIST WHO WORKS IN THE ALTERNATIVE REALM.
I DO THE STORIES THAT THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA DOESN'T DO.
I HAD WRITTEN ABOUT MARK FOLEY IN 2003.
THAT HAD GOTTEN A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF ATTENTION.
THAT WAS WHAT LED TO MY INVOLVEMENT WITH CRIST
IN TERMS OF WRITING ABOUT CRIST.
A SOURCE CONTACTED ME VIA EMAIL.
THIS SOURCE WAS AT A DINNER PARTY
AT A MULTIMILLION DOLLAR MANSION
IN FORT LAUDERDALE.
AND HE WAS WITH A YOUNG STAFFER NAMED JASON WETHERINGTON.
JASON WAS A YOUNG REPUBLICAN STAFFER
WORKING FOR KATHERINE HARRIS,
THE FAMOUS MASCARA'D QUEEN OF THE 2000 ELECTION.
JASON SAID THAT HE HAD MET CHARLIE CRIST,
HAD A RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM-- A SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM,
AND HE EXPECTED AFTER CRIST WON THE ELECTION,
HE WOULD GET AN APPOINTMENT TO CRIST'S ADMINISTRATION
AND THAT HE HAD HOPED TO CONTINUE THE RELATIONSHIP.
I FELT THAT THIS SOURCE WAS COMPLETELY EARNEST
AND HONEST. SO I DECIDED I WAS GOING TO GO SEE JASON WETHERINGTON.
HE WAS VERY, VERY UNCOMFORTABLE WITH THE LINE OF QUESTIONING.
THAT WAS OBVIOUS. HE INITIALLY SAID
THAT HE HADN'T SAID THAT AT THE DINNER PARTY.
THEN HE HEDGED THAT A BIT.
"WELL, YOU KNOW, I MIGHT HAVE BEEN DRINKING." THAT KIND OF THING.
HE WAS EXTREMELY UPSET
AND JUST SAID, "DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO."
I know you've addressed this question
once or twice before-- the whisper campaign by your opponents
about whether or not you're gay.
Now I don't care whether you are or not--
It's fine.
AND THEN I GOT ANOTHER PHONE CALL.
IT WAS FROM ANOTHER FRIEND OF JASON WETHERINGTON'S.
THERE WAS A DINNER PARTY THAT WAS HELD AT MY HOME
AND JASON WAS AT THE PARTY.
HE BEGAN TO ALLUDE THAT THERE WAS A RELATIONSHIP
BETWEEN CRIST AND HIM AND THAT IT WAS PHYSICAL.
NOW I'VE GOT TWO SOURCES
WHO ARE SAYING THE EXACT SAME THING
WHO DON'T KNOW EACH OTHER.
IT WAS REVEALED THAT NIGHT
THAT HE-- THAT CRIST DID HAVE A PARTNER
OR THERE WAS ANOTHER MAN IN HIS LIFE.
IT WAS BRUCE CARLTON JORDAN.
HE WAS FRIENDS WITH JAY VASS,
A VETERAN REPUBLICAN PILOT
AND JAY VASS'S GIRLFRIEND DEE DEE HALL.
...the sworn statement you give
will be the truth, the whole truth
- and nothing but the truth, so help you God? - Yes.
Do you know a gentleman by the name of Bruce Jordan?
Yes, I do.
Did he tell you that he was gay?
Yes. He brought up the fact
that he was in a relationship...
that he was involved with Charlie.
I was like, "Okay." He just stated his first name.
And he said, "Maybe you've heard of him." He said, "It's Charlie Crist."
I CONTACTED CHARLIE ON THE PHONE
AND ASKED HIM DIRECTLY ABOUT JASON WETHERINGTON
AND, UH...
AND BRUCE CARLTON JORDAN.
CHARLIE VERY SMOOTHLY DENIED THAT HE KNEW
OR REMEMBERED KNOWING EITHER ONE OF THESE PEOPLE.
The Governor-elect of the State of Florida-- Charlie Crist!
Nearly 4,000 children are waiting to be adopted
in Florida, but the state is still turning away couples looking to adopt.
Why? Because they're gay.
Frank Gill is a gay foster parent
who wants to make it permanent.
Gill and his partner have been foster parents for four years
to these two boys, now four and eight years old.
They were neglected and abandoned by their birth parents.
Florida's the only state in the country that bans gay adoption.
Governor Charlie Crist has supported the prohibition on gay adoption
and tells "The Herald" he has "no second thoughts" on that.
WELCOME BACK. I'M MICHELANGELO SIGNORILE
ON SIRIUS OUTQ 109.
MIKE ROGERS, THE MOST FEARED MAN ON CAPITOL HILL
ACCORDING TO "THE WASHINGTON POST,"
IS NOW HERE IN THE STUDIO.
HE IS THE MAN WHO GOT THE BALL ROLLING
ON LARRY CRAIG THE SENATOR FROM IDAHO.
- WELCOME TO THE SHOW. - I HEARD YOU'RE GAY.
ARE YOU GONNA OUT ME NOW?
THAT'S WHAT THEY SAY.
THIS IS ALWAYS A QUESTION THAT PEOPLE PUT OUT THERE:
ARE YOU ONLY FOCUSED ON REPUBLICANS
OR ARE THERE CLOSETED DEMOCRATS DOING DAMAGE
AND HOW COME THEY'RE NOT BEING EXPOSED?
WHAT I TELL FOLKS IS THE REASON THAT 90% OF THE CASES OR SO
ARE REPUBLICANS SAYS A LOT MORE
ABOUT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY THAN IT DOES MY WORK.
AND WHAT WE'RE SHOWING IS IT'S THE CLOSET.
IT'S NOT HOMOSEXUALITY.
IT'S THE CLOSET THAT BREEDS THAT KIND OF--
- AND THE CLOSET OF HYPOCRISY. - ABSOLUTELY.
AND IT HAS GIVEN A LOT OF CREDIBILITY TO THE WORK YOU BEGAN A DECADE AGO.
I WENT TO JOURNALISM SCHOOL,
LEFT, THOUGHT I WAS GONNA GET THIS GREAT SERIOUS NEWS JOB,
AND WOUND UP WORKING FOR A P.R. FIRM
THAT SPECIALIZED IN GOSSIP.
AND IT WAS IN THAT WORLD, IN THE '80s,
THAT I SAW HOW THE GOSSIP WORLD
WOULD GLAMORIZE HETEROSEXUALITY,
BUT ANYTHING ABOUT ANY CELEBRITY
WHO WAS SECRETLY GAY, WE WOULD HELP THEM COVER.
IT WAS THE ONE AREA WHERE THEY DIDN'T DEMAND THE TRUTH.
EVERYWHERE ELSE, THEY WANTED TO KNOW WHO WAS DATING WHO,
BUT WHEN IT CAME TO GAY CELEBRITIES,
IT WAS ACCEPTED AND UNDERSTOOD THAT YOU COVERED FOR THEM
AND YOU ACTUALLY PUT OUT LIES.
I STARTED TO WRITE A COLUMN CALLED "GOSSIP WATCH."
IT WAS A WATCH OF THE GOSSIP COLUMNS.
IT WAS A LOOK AT HOW THE GOSSIP COLUMNS,
WHICH ARE READ BY MORE PEOPLE
THAN ANY OTHER FORUM IN THE MEDIA,
ARE COMPLETELY CONSTRUCTED AND CREATED
TO GLAMORIZE HETEROSEXUALITY
AND KEEP HOMOSEXUALITY INVISIBLE.
IN 1990 MALCOLM FORBES,
THE MULTIMILLIONAIRE PUBLISHER OF "FORBES" MAGAZINE,
DIED AND THE MEDIA IMMEDIATELY,
IN ALL OF HIS OBITUARIES,
HELD HIM UP AS A VERY SUCCESSFUL CAPITALIST
WHO WAS DATING ELIZABETH TAYLOR FOR YEARS.
AND YET, THEY LEFT OUT THE FACT THAT HE WAS GAY.
IT TOOK YEARS, IN FACT,
FOR "THE NEW YORK TIMES"
TO FINALLY SAY THAT MALCOLM FORBES WAS GAY.
I FELT THAT THE HISTORICAL RECORD
HAD TO BE CORRECTED IMMEDIATELY.
Michelangelo Signorile is his name.
He's the one who outed Malcolm Forbes after his death,
writing that Forbes,
the very symbol of establishment capitalism,
secretly was gay.
I'm certainly not doing anything wrong. I think in 20 years from now,
we're gonna look back and say, "What the hell was the big deal about?"
WELCOME BACK. 11 MINUTES BEFORE THE HOUR,
I'M MICHELANGELO SIGNORILE. I'M HERE WITH MIKE ROGERS
IN STUDIO AND WE'RE TAKING YOUR CALLS.
YOU'RE ON "THE MICHELANGELO SIGNORILE SHOW."
What happens when you guys expose
all of the closeted people in the conservative movement?
You get all the hypocrites out of there, what have you got left
but just the solid non-hypocritical festival of hate?
IT'S A FAIR QUESTION. MIKE, WHAT DO YOU THINK? THANKS FOR THAT, GREG.
IN MOST CASES WHEN SOMEBODY IS REPORTED ON, THEY BECOME A PRO-GAY LEGISLATOR.
BUT "IS THERE A BACKLASH?" WHICH IS WHAT HE'S ASKING.
WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU LEAVE JUST THIS CORE OF HATE?
WELL, BARNEY FRANK PUTS IT BEST:
"THE REASON PEOPLE HATE GAY PEOPLE IS BECAUSE THEIR LEADERS TELL THEM TO."
I THINK THAT EACH ONE OF THESE OUTINGS
PUTS A LITTLE CHINK IN THE ARMOR
OF THE ANTI-GAY SO-CALLED "FAMILY VALUES" MOVEMENT.
I, RONALD REAGAN, DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR...
"THAT I WILL FAITHFULLY EXECUTE
THE OFFICE OF PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES."
...THAT I WILL FAITHFULLY EXECUTE THE OFFICE
OF PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
THE ELECTION OF RONALD REAGAN BROUGHT US
A FAIRLY LARGE NUMBER
OF HIGH-PLACED BUT CLOSETED GAY MEN
IN THE REPUBLICAN ADMINISTRATION
WHO FAILED TO ADEQUATELY ADDRESS
THE EPIDEMIC OF AIDS.
THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
WOULD NOT EVEN SAY THE WORD "AIDS" PUBLICALLY
AS LATE AS 1987.
REAGAN HAD BEEN ELECTED
ON THIS FUNDAMENTALIST CONSERVATIVE ROLE IN AMERICA
LED BY THE NATIONAL CONSERVATIVE POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE.
THE PRESIDENT OF NCPAC WAS TERRY DOLAN!
TERRY IS DANCING AT FLAMINGO ON THE WEEKEND IN NEW YORK
AND PROPPING UP
THE MOST RIGHT-WING HOMOPHOBES IN AMERICA BY DAY.
THIS IS A MAN WHO'S RAISING MONEY
TO KILL US-- TERRY DOLAN.
I WENT TO A COCKTAIL PARTY IN WASHINGTON AND THERE HE WAS.
I THREW A DRINK IN HIS FACE.
I SAID, "HOW DARE YOU COME TO A PARTY OF GAY PEOPLE
AFTER WHAT YOU'RE DOING TO US?!"
RICHARD KRAUSE-- THE HEAD OF THE N.I.H.,
IN CHARGE OF ALL THE INFECTIOUS DISEASES AT THE TIME OF ADVENT OF AIDS,
WOULD NOT DO ANYTHING
THAT WAS REQUIRED BY THE SITUATION, ANYTHING HEROIC,
SIMPLY BECAUSE HE WAS AFRAID HE'D SPEND HIS ENTIRE CAREER
TRYING NOT TO BE IDENTIFIED WITH US.
EVERYONE KNOWS RICHARD IS GAY. HE'S GOT PICTURES OF BOYFRIENDS ON HIS DRESSER AT HOME.
SO THAT CLOSET CAN KILL OTHER PEOPLE AND IT HAS.
BEFORE AIDS,
WE WERE CONCERNED WITH PRIVACY.
AFTER AIDS, THAT WAS COLLUSION WITH GENOCIDE--
BEING SILENT, BEING INVISIBLE--
PARTICULARLY IN AN ELECTED OR APPOINTED OFFICIAL,
PARTICULARLY IN AN ELECTED OR APPOINTED OFFICIAL
WHOSE RESPONSIBILITY IT IS TO RESPOND TO THIS PUBLIC HEALTH CRISIS--
AND THEY DIDN'T BECAUSE THEY WERE CLOSETED GAYS.
# COME ON ALONG AND LISTEN TO #
# THE LULLABY OF BROADWAY. #
ED KOCH WAS MAYOR OF NEW YORK CITY
AND HE DIDN'T WANT TO LIFT A HAND TO HELP GAY PEOPLE.
HE WOULD NOT DO ANYTHING
THAT WAS REQUIRED BY THE SITUATION.
FUCK YOU.
SAN FRANCISCO'S AIDS ORGANIZATION
WAS GETTING MONEY FROM THEIR MAYOR IN HUGE AMOUNTS.
WE WEREN'T GETTING ANYTHING.
AND IT PISSED ME OFF MORE AND MORE AND MORE
BECAUSE WE ALL KNEW HE WAS GAY.
NOW ED KOCH HAD ALWAYS CONSISTENTLY IN HIS PUBLIC LIFE
REFUSED TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT HIS SEXUALITY.
WHEN ED'S THIRD OR FOURTH TERM WAS COMING UP
I WAS ASKED THEN
BY PRESS PEOPLE TO ACKNOWLEDGE
THAT RICHARD NATHAN WAS ED'S FORMER LOVER.
AND SO I STONEWALLED THE PRESS DURING THAT PRIMARY RACE
'CAUSE I DIDN'T WANT TO BE THE VOICE THAT OUTED A CANDIDATE.
ABOUT '74 OR '75, WHEN HE WAS IN CONGRESS,
ED KOCH WAS PLANNING TO RUN FOR MAYOR
AND HE STARTED HAVING SUNDAY-NIGHT POTLUCK SUPPERS
AT HIS APARTMENT IN THE VILLAGE.
ONE NIGHT, RICHARD AND I WERE AT ED'S HOUSE
AND AS WE WERE DEPARTING, ED SAID, "OH, RICHARD, STAY."
AND RICHARD SAID, "NO, ED.I HAVE TO GO. I'LL CALL YOU LATER."
SO AS WE WERE WALKING ACROSS WASHINGTON SQUARE PARK,
I SAID, "WHAT WAS THAT ALL ABOUT?
YOU AND THE CONGRESSMAN?" AND HE SAID, "WE'RE HAVING A RELATIONSHIP."
AND I SAID, "YOU MEAN, LIKE A 'RELATIONSHIP'?"
AND HE SAID, "YEAH." AND I SAID, "WHY?
YOU'RE A NICE-LOOKING YOUNG MAN.
HE'S AN OLD AND NOT TERRIBLY ATTRACTIVE MAN."
AND HE SAID, "IT'S A REAL APHRODISIAC
WHEN YOU GET A CALL FROM CONGRESS SAYING,
'I'M COMING IN. LET'S HAVE DINNER FRIDAY NIGHT.'"
THE DAY ED KOCH WAS INAUGURATED, THERE WAS A PRIVATE PARTY.
WE WATCHED ED COME IN WITH BESS,
CLUTCHING THEIR PINKIES.
AND RICHARD SAID, "I'M OUT OF HERE.
IT'S BEEN MADE CLEAR TO ME THAT I HAVE TO LEAVE TOWN,
OR AT LEAST NOT BE IN THE PICTURE,
SO I'VE DECIDED TO MOVE TO CALIFORNIA."
ABOUT A YEAR OR TWO AFTER I GOT TO KNOW DICK,
HE SAID HE HAD SOMETHING HE WANTED ME TO KNOW.
OVER THE COURSE OF A COUPLE OF YEARS,
HE HAD BEEN LOVERS OF ED KOCH
AND AFTER THEY BROKE UP, ED HAD MADE IT IMPOSSIBLE FOR HIM TO WORK IN NEW YORK.
NO INSTANCE OF HOMOPHOBIA
HURT HIM MORE
THAN THE TREATMENT BY THE MAN HE WAS IN LOVE WITH.
I WAS AT A FUNDRAISING EVENT IN LOS ANGELES IN '81.
A MAN CAME UP TO ME AND SAID, "I'M DICK NATHAN."
THEN HE PROCEEDED TO TELL ME ABOUT HIS AFFAIR WITH ED KOCH
AND WHAT A PIG HE WAS, AND THAT HE WAS PREPARED FINALLY
TO COME AND ANNOUNCE PUBLICALLY THAT ED KOCH WAS GAY,
WHICH WAS WHAT WE NEEDED.
HE CAME TO NEW YORK.
AND, OH BOY, WE WERE BESIDE OURSELVES.
AND DICK NATHAN CAME AND SAID, "I'M SORRY, I CAN'T DO IT."
DICK WAS WORRIED ABOUT HIS SAFETY.
AND DICK DID FEEL THAT IF HE WENT PUBLIC,
HE WOULD SUFFER.
DICK WAS THREATENED, PHYSICALLY THREATENED,
AND FINANCIALLY. AND HE CAME AND HE WAS TERRIFIED
IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT, LEAVING THE CITY.
I FIRST MET JIM McCRERY IN THE FALL OF 1975
AT THE SIGMA NU FRATERNITY HOUSE.
I KNEW FROM THE MOMENT WE MET THAT HE WAS INTERESTED.
AND IT WAS THE NEXT SUMMER DURING SUMMER SCHOOL
THAT IT BEGAN.
THE MOMENT I SPOKE TO GARY, I KNEW HE WAS TELLING THE TRUTH,
BUT NONETHELESS, FOR HIS OWN PROTECTION
AND FOR THE PROTECTION OF THE MAGAZINE,
WE WANTED TO SOURCE IT AS THOUGH "THE NEW YORK TIMES" WAS DOING IT.
SO WE FOUND SEVERAL PEOPLE
WHO ALSO HAD SEXUAL RELATIONSHIPS WITH JIM McCRERY
WHO HAD SIGNED LEGAL AFFIDAVITS.
JIM IS SEVEN YEARS MY SENIOR.
HE WOULD JUST APPEAR AT THE FRATERNITY HOUSE
FROM TIME-- YOU KNOW, HIS ANNUAL PILGRIMAGE,
SO TO SPEAK, IN THE FALL.
JIM USED THE FRATERNITY HOUSE AS HIS GAY BAR.
HE WOULD FIND YOUNG MEN
WHO HE THOUGHT HE HAD A GOOD CHANCE
AT HAVING A SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP WITH.
JIM WOULD COME INTO MY ROOM AT NIGHTTIME,
COME TOUCH ME A LITTLE INAPPROPRIATELY AT TIMES.
HE WAS MY FIRST SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP,
AS HE WAS A NUMBER OF MY FRATERNITY BROTHERS.
McCRERY WAS AMBITIOUS TO THE POINT
WHERE HE WOULD MAKE MORAL COMPROMISES.
BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THAT MORAL COMPROMISING
IS ABOUT YOUR OWN IDENTITY?
THE JIM I HAD-- AND EVERYONE HAD ALWAYS KNOWN
HAD BEEN AN ATHEIST.
HE HAD GIVEN SPEECHES ABOUT HIS LACK OF BELIEF.
HE WAS A DEMOCRAT, VERY LIBERAL,
HAD NO PROBLEM
SAYING HIS OPINION
ON THE IMMORALITY OF THE SODOMY LAWS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
WHEN A GROUP OF BACKERS CAME TO HIM
AND DECIDED THAT HE WAS GOING TO BE THEIR CANDIDATE,
HE CHANGED HIS PARTY
AND THEN WENT DOWN AND JOINED THE CHURCH THAT HAD THE BIGGEST COLUMNS
FOR HIM TO HAVE HIS CAMPAIGN PICTURES TAKEN IN FRONT OF,
AND RAN AS A RIGHT-WING CHRISTIAN COALITION CANDIDATE.
HE BECAME A TOTALLY DIFFERENT PERSON.
I'm Johnette McCrery.
I believe my husband Jim is the kind of person
we need in Congress today.
He's good-hearted, but he's not soft-hearted.
He's sensitive without being foolish.
IN 1992,
JIM CAME TO MY HOUSE, SPENT THE NIGHT
AND WE HAD SEX.
WE NEVER DISCUSSED HIS POLITICAL PLATFORM
OR WHAT HE BELIEVED IN. WE JUST HAD SEX.
Bottom line, Jim's a good husband,
a good father and a good congressman.
He gets my vote.
Would you please give him yours on election day?
TO BE ABLE TO LIVE THIS KIND OF A LIE,
THIS HAS GONE ON NOW FOR 17, 18-- NO, 20! --20 YEARS.
THAT'S THE MAIN THING THAT ATTRACTED ME TO MITT ROMNEY
WAS HIS STRONG SENSE OF PERSONAL COMMITMENT
TO HIS WIFE, HIS FAMILY,
TO HIS VALUES. IT'S NOT SOMETHING HE JUST TALKS ABOUT.
IT'S SOMETHING HE LIVES.
THE CLOSEST THING TO A TURNING POINT
WAS WHEN I WENT TO THE GRAVE
OF A SIGMA NU BROTHER
THAT DIED OF AIDS.
JIM KNEW HIM WELL.
ONE OF MY BEST FRIENDS.
STANDING OVER THAT GRAVE, IT DID A LOT.
IT LET ME KNOW THAT I HAD TO DO IT.
I HAD TO DO IT.
THERE WAS SOME ATTENTION
IN THE NATIONAL MEDIA, VERY, VERY LITTLE ON A LOCAL LEVEL.
THE NON-GAY PRESS SAW IT AS SORT OF DISTASTEFUL.
THEY DIDN'T COVER GAY LIFE AT ALL,
EXCEPT MAYBE THE MOST DRAMATIC ELEMENTS OF IT.
IT WAS GARY
THAT REAPED ALL THE HAVOC FROM THIS.
HE WAS SHUNNED BY THE COMMUNITY.
HIS PARENTS RECEIVED
ALL SORTS OF HATE MAIL. AND JIM--
NOTHING HAPPENED TO JIM.
HE WAS ELEVATED EVEN HIGHER.
JIM IS RETIRING
FROM A GREAT CONGRESSIONAL CAREER--
THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF HONORS AND AWARDS.
HOW MANY OF THOSE WOULD HE HAVE GOTTEN
IF HE HAD BEEN TRUE TO HIMSELF?
WHAT I FEEL THAT I'M DOING IN THIS OUTING WORK,
IT'S NOT ABOUT ANYBODY WHO'S ALIVE TODAY.
IT'S ABOUT TOMORROW'S GENERATION
AND THE ONE AFTER AND THE ONE AFTER,
'CAUSE THIS HATE, THIS VITRIOL,
IT'S GENERATIONAL FOR THESE ANTI-GAY PEOPLE.
MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE OF THE GOOD ACTIVISTS--
IT IS ALL DRIVEN BY RAGE,
RIGHTEOUS INDIGNATION. PEOPLE ARE SUFFERING AND DYING
BECAUSE SOME SELF-PROMOTING ASSHOLE IS TELLING A LIE.
ACTIVISM IS ABOUT ANGER.
ACTIVISM IS ABOUT RESPONDING
TO SOMETHING THAT YOU KNOW IS WRONG
- AND YOU DON'T LIKE IT.
Sure.
We're here for the consideration of H.J.RES.106
proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States
relating to marriage as well as H.R.319...
DREIER'S VOTING IS A MATTER OF RECORD.
IT IS WITHOUT QUESTION
SOMEWHAT HOSTILE TO GAYS. AND, IN FACT,
HE IS A FRONTLINE MEMBER OF A POLITICAL PARTY
WHERE A CONSIDERABLE WING OF THAT POLITICAL PARTY
IS OPENLY HOSTILE TO GAYS.
DAVID DREIER OFFICIALLY STILL DENIES BEING GAY,
DESPITE LOTS OF EVIDENCE TO THE CONTRARY.
YOU COULD HEAR IN THE NEWSROOM, JUST OCCASIONALLY WHEN A STORY WOULD COME UP,
THAT DREIER WAS QUOTE--
WHAT I REALIZED BEFORE LONG, IT WAS CODE WORDS--
"CONFIRMED BACHELOR," "CONSERVATIVE BACHELOR," "DAPPER BACHELOR."
ONE OF THE BIG TIPS I GOT WAS, "CHECK OUT THE BOYFRIEND."
I'M LIKE, "WHO'S THE BOYFRIEND?"
"THE CHIEF OF STAFF." I'M LIKE, "OHH, THAT'S INTERESTING."
SO THEN WE INITIATED A WHOLE INVESTIGATION.
I GO DOWN TO THE CAPITAL AND I COPY EVERY TRAVEL RECORD
OF BRAD SMITH, WHO'S THE CHIEF OF STAFF,
AND DAVID DREIER, WHO'S THE CONGRESSMAN.
THEY SAID, "OH WELL, HE TRAVELS WITH HIM."
AND I'M LIKE, "WELL, THESE ARE DIFFERENT DATES...
ONE DAY APART ON ALL THE TRIPS."
IF THERE WAS A CONGRESSMAN
WHO TRAVELED WITH HIS CHIEF OF STAFF CONTINUOUSLY AROUND THE WORLD,
TRAVELING ONE DAY BEFORE OR ONE DAY AFTER,
THAT WOULD BE IN THE NEWSPAPER.
BUT BECAUSE HE'S SLEEPING WITH A MAN,
BECAUSE IT'S TWO DICKS INSTEAD OF ONE,
THAT'S THEIR PROBLEM.
WE'RE NOT ASKING DREIER WHAT POSITION HE LIKES,
HOW MANY LOVERS HE'S HAD, WHERE HE LIKES TO GET IT ON.
THESE AREN'T THE QUESTIONS WE WANT TO PUT TO DREIER.
THE QUESTIONS THAT SHOULD BE PUT TO DREIER ARE:
"THIS IS YOUR VOTING RECORD. THIS IS YOUR PARTY'S PLATFORM, ITS PLANK, ITS POSITIONS,
AND IT SEEMS TO RUN ABSOLUTELY CONTRADICTORY
TO THE WAY YOU'VE LIVED YOUR PERSONAL LIFE."
WHEN HE CAME ON MY PROGRAM DURING THE REPUBLICAN CONVENTION,
I ASKED HIM STRAIGHT OUT.
There have been a lot of rumors that you yourself are gay.
And people feel it's hypocritical of you--
- --to not speak up in favor of same-sex marriage.
Are you saying you're heterosexual?
A STRAIGHT GUY, THERE'S NO WAY HE'LL ANSWER THAT QUESTION
WITH, "I'M NOT REALLY HERE TO TALK ABOUT THAT."
HE'S GONNA SAY, "YEAH, I'M STRAIGHT. SO WHAT?"
Would you think it's hypocritical
if a gay politician were voting against gay people?
YOU KNOW, I HAPPEN TO LIKE DAVID DREIER'S
POLITICAL AND POLICY WORK ON MANY FRONTS.
AND HE LOST OUT
IN BEING THE NEW REPUBLICAN LEADER
INSIDE A CAUCUS INSIDE THE REPUBLICAN COMMUNITY
BECAUSE OF THE GAY IDENTITY ISSUE.
Did you expect to get the job
that Roy Blunt got?
No, this is not something that I pursued.
I mean, yes, I was talked to about this.
And frankly, I said no, that I didn't want to do it.
Now who talked to you about it? Is this--
You know, I don't want to get into that, Charlie.
THE EVANGELICAL CONSERVATIVE WING OF THE PARTY
CAME IN AND SAID, "NOT FOR ONE MINUTE. NOT ON YOUR LIFE.
DAVID DREIER'S A CLOSETED GAY. THIS IS A HUGE PROBLEM FOR US.
AND IT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN."
I THINK IT WAS A REAL SAD THING
THAT THE COUNTRY LOST SOMEONE LIKE DAVID DREIER
MOVING INTO REPUBLICAN LEADERSHIP OVER BEING GAY.
THE ULTIMATE IRONY? I BELIEVE IF DAVID DREIER
CALLED A PRESS CONFERENCE TOMORROW AND ANNOUNCED, "THIS IS MY TRUTH--
30 YEARS IN COMING, BUT THIS IS MY TRUTH."
I THINK HE'D PROBABLY BE RE-ELECTED.
IF HE DECIDES TO EVENTUALLY COME OUT,
HE'LL DO SO WHEN HE DECIDES TO RETIRE FROM THE HOUSE.
THAT'S A TRAGEDY. IT'S MUCH BETTER
TO HAVE SOMEONE OF DAVID DREIER'S
REALLY BRILLIANT LEGISLATIVE SKILL
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES FINALLY COMING OUT OF HIS OWN VOLITION.
SO IS THERE AN EFFORT? PROBABLY.
HAS HE MOVED? NO.
LESBIAN AND GAY ISSUES
ARE UNDER-REPORTED AND UNDER-COVERED IN THE MEDIA
SOMETIMES BECAUSE OUR ALLIES IN THE MEDIA
ARE TRYING TO BE SENSITIVE TO NOT OUT SOMEBODY.
ALL OF MY STRAIGHT FRIENDS IN THE MEDIA
HANDLE THIS ISSUE BADLY,
UM, BECAUSE I THINK IT'S DISCOMFITING.
THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT.
Right after the break, we're gonna interview Erik Weihenmayer
who climbed the highest mountain in the world, Mount Everest.
But he's gay!
I mean, he's gay-- excuse me. He's blind.
So we'll hear about that coming up.
PEOPLE WILL WRITE ABOUT MY RELIGION.
THEY WILL WRITE ABOUT MY HEIGHT, WRITE ABOUT MY SCHOOLING.
THEY WILL WRITE ABOUT A WHOLE RANGE OF THINGS.
IF THEY WON'T WRITE ABOUT MY SEXUALITY,
THEY'RE IN EFFECT SAYING, "THE POOR SO-AND-SO.
THAT IS SUCH A TERRIBLE FACT WE HAVE TO KEEP IT SECRET."
JOURNALISTS ARE IN THE BUSINESS OF TELLING THE TRUTH.
THEY SHOULD BE CONSTANTLY REEVALUATING WHAT THEY'RE DOING
AND LOOKING AT WHY THEY TREAT HOMOSEXUALITY AND HETEROSEXUALITY DIFFERENTLY.
MY FAMILY JOKES THAT WHEN THEY WATCH THE NEWS WITH ME
LIKE, "THAT REPORTER'S GAY." IT PERMEATES THE MEDIA HERE.
ALL THE REPORTERS ARE GAY. YOU KNOW?
CNN AND FOX, THE SAME ONES WHO ARE COVERING THE STORY,
THEY'RE PART OF THE WASHINGTON CULTURE TOO. SO FOR THEM TO BE AMBITIOUS,
THEY DON'T TALK ABOUT THEIR SEXUAL ORIENTATION AND HAVEN'T FOR YEARS.
Live from New York,
this is "The Fox Report" with Shepard Smith.
J-Lo's new song "Jenny from the Block,"
all about Lopez's roots,
about how she's still a neighborhood gal at heart.
But folks from the Bronx section
sound more likely to give her a curb job
than a blowjob-- or block party.
I'm sorry about that slip up there.
I have no idea how that happened, but it won't happen again.
I WAS AT A BAR IN NEW YORK,
A GAY PIANO BAR ON THE UPPER EAST SIDE CALLED "BRANDY'S."
WE SAT DOWN NEXT TO THIS GUY
AND IT WAS SHEPARD SMITH FROM FOX NEWS.
HE STARTED CHATTING ME UP
AND BUYING ME DRINKS.
AND, UH, HE ASKED ME IF I'D COME BACK TO HIS APARTMENT...
AT 3:00 IN THE MORNING.
A YEAR WENT BY AND HE STARTED GETTING A LOT OF EXPOSURE
AS THE NEW RISING STAR OF CABLE TV NEWS.
HE WAS GRANTING INTERVIEWS TO REPORTERS
AND BEING PROFILED IN "THE NEW YORK TIMES"
AND WAS BEING MORE THAN COY ABOUT HIS SEXUAL ORIENTATION.
BECAUSE IT WAS ASKED, AND HE WAS EITHER LYING
OR DODGING THE QUESTION.
IT WAS AT THAT POINT THAT I SAID, "OKAY,
TIME TO COME OUT."
I THINK IT TO THIS DAY REMAINS
THE MOST POPULAR COLUMN THAT I'VE EVER WRITTEN.
EVERYONE LOVES A GOOD OUTING.
THIS TOWN IS FULL OF GAY PEOPLE.
I REMEMBER WHEN I FIRST MOVED HERE THINKING HOW GAY IT WAS.
SOMETIMES I THINK WASHINGTON'S MORE GAY THAN SAN FRANCISCO IS.
CAPITOL HILL IS PACKED
WITH GAY STAFFERS.
THERE ARE SO MANY OF THEM.
YOU CAN'T SWING A DEAD CAT
WITHOUT HITTING A GAY STAFFER.
THERE'S A RUNNING JOKE
THAT GAY MEN MAKE CAPITOL HILL RUN ON TIME.
THEY DON'T HAVE A WIFE OR CHILDREN TO GO HOME TO,
SO THEY CAN WORK REALLY LONG HOURS.
I THINK IF THEY TRIED TO FIRE GAY STAFF
LIKE THEY DO BOOTING PEOPLE OUT OF THE MILITARY,
THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WOULD SCREECH TO A HALT.
TO THIS DAY, I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY PLACE LIKE IT.
SO IT IS PROBABLY THE MOST GAY PLACE.
UNFORTUNATELY, IT'S PROBABLY STILL THE MOST CLOSETED PLACE.
THERE ARE SCORES OF CLOSETED REPUBLICANS
AND DEMOCRATS, I MIGHT ADD,
WHO JUST BECAUSE OF THEIR LIFE JOURNEY,
BECAUSE OF THEIR GENERATIONAL EXPERIENCE,
BECAUSE OF THEIR DESIRE NOT TO BE VULNERABLE
IN TERMS OF GETTING RE-ELECTED,
HAVE CHOSEN TO STAY IN THE CLOSET.
YEAH?
FROM THE DAY I FIRST GOT ELECTED TO PUBLIC OFFICE
IN 1972, I WAS CLOSETED FOR THE FIRST 15 OF THOSE YEARS.
MY ORIGINAL VIEW WAS THAT I COULD BE
PUBLICALLY KIND OF NEUTRAL,
AND PRIVATELY I COULD LIVE THE LIFE OF A GAY MAN.
BUT IT DOESN'T WORK. BECAUSE WHEN YOU'RE REASONABLY PROMINENT,
WHAT CAN YOU DO? YOU CAN'T GO TO BARS TO MEET PEOPLE.
YOU CAN'T--
YOU CAN'T MEET PEOPLE WITHOUT OUTING YOURSELF,
SO IT'S KIND OF HARD TO BE PUBLIC AND CLOSETED.
THERE WERE LOTS OF RUMORS THAT HAVE BEEN AROUND.
AND I WAS ALWAYS CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT KINDS OF THINGS
WOULD COME UP IN A CAMPAIGN OR WHAT THINGS MIGHT BE SAID.
SO, YOU KNOW,
THERE WAS THAT KIND OF THING THAT GNAWS AT YOU.
IT'S JUST THERE. IT'S SITTING ON YOUR SHOULDER
LIKE A LITTLE TWEETY BIRD SITTING ON YOUR SHOULDER
ABOUT TO CHIRP AT YOU.
AND YOU NEVER KNOW WHEN IT'S GOING TO DO THAT.
IF YOU ARE A LESBIAN DEEPLY IN THE CLOSET
AND YOU'RE HAVING A CONVERSATION ABOUT,
YOU KNOW, WHO YOU SHARE YOUR LIFE WITH,
YOU EITHER HAVE TO LIE
AND SAY "HE" RATHER THAN "SHE"
IN REFERRING TO YOUR PARTNER,
BUT ALTERNATIVELY
USING GENDERLESS PRONOUNS.
"WE HAD A GOOD WEEKEND."
AND, YOU KNOW, JUST SORT OF AVOIDING IT.
AND REALLY, THAT TAKES A LOT OF ENERGY TO DO
TO MAKE SURE YOUR STORY'S STRAIGHT, SO TO SPEAK.
WHEN YOU'RE LIVING IN THE CLOSET,
THE FEAR IS THAT SOMEONE'S GOING TO EXPOSE YOU
FOR THEIR POLITICAL GAIN TO TAKE YOU DOWN.
AND SO YOU'RE ALWAYS WONDERING,
"IS THIS THE CONVERSATION? IS THIS THE PERSON?
IS THIS THE SITUATION?"
WHEN I RAN FOR MAYOR THE FIRST TIME,
I RECEIVED THREAT LETTERS AND THREAT PHONE CALLS.
I'VE SAVED THE LETTERS AND ONE OF THEM SAID,
"WE'RE COMING TO THE PUBLIC FORUM
AND WE'RE GOING TO EXPOSE YOU
SO ALL YOUR SUPPORTERS WILL KNOW
THAT YOU'RE REALLY A GAY MAN."
FOR ANYONE TO KNOW THAT YOU'RE GAY,
TO BE THE GAY "ANYTHING,"
WOULD BE THE WORST THING IN THE WORLD TO HAPPEN TO YOU.
YOU COULD LOSE YOUR FAMILY. YOU COULD LOSE YOUR JOB. YOU COULD LOSE YOUR POWER
OR POLITICAL POSITION. YOU COULD LOSE YOUR SEAT IN CONGRESS.
I'VE HAD MEMBERS OF CONGRESS
CRYING IN MY ARMS
BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO COME OUT.
WHEN YOU TRY TO COMPARTMENTALIZE
ALL THESE PARTS OF YOUR LIFE
AND IF YOU TRY TO SHOVE YOUR SEXUAL ORIENTATION INTO A BOX
AND KEEP IT FROM YOUR CONSTITUENTS,
IT HAS VERY DEADLY CONSEQUENCES.
Good afternoon.
Throughout my life,
I have grappled with my own identity-- who I am.
As a young child, I often felt ambivalent
about myself, in fact, confused.
From the first words out of his mouth this afternoon,
it was clear Jim McGreevy, the governor of New Jersey,
was making very big news indeed.
At a point in every person's life,
one has to look deeply into the mirror of one's soul
and decide one's unique truth.
And beyond the facts and allegations and anguish
immediately surrounding his story,
what the governor said today
also becomes part of a larger story
at a turning point for the country.
And so my truth is that I am a gay American.
Another boundary of American politics
has been crossed today.
With his wife by his side, the governor announced
that he is gay,
that he had an affair with a man, and that he would resign.
His announcement makes him the highest-ranking American politician...
I BEGAN TO UNDERSTAND THAT EVEN IN GRAMMAR SCHOOL
THAT SOMEHOW I WAS PROFOUNDLY DIFFERENT.
NO ONE COMES UP TO YOU
AND TELLS YOU THAT YOU'RE AFRICAN-AMERICAN,
OR JEWISH-AMERICAN OR IRISH-AMERICAN.
YOU DISCOVER YOU'RE GAY
BY YOURSELF.
AND I WAS GOING TO THE PUBLIC LIBRARY AND LOOKING FOR
"WHAT IS HOMOSEXUALITY? WHAT ARE ITS ORIGINS?"
AND HOW IT'S DESCRIBED.
IT WAS ALL HORRIFIC. IT WAS ALL APOCALYPTIC.
IT WAS A CURSE.
I ACCEPTED ALL THOSE MESSAGES OF SHAME
AND MESSAGES OF HATE,
MESSAGES OF IGNORANCE.
BUT YOU REALIZE IT'S INTRINSIC.
IT'S WHO AND WHAT YOU ARE.
AND SO YOU DENY THIS THING,
BUT WHAT HAPPENS IS IT COMES OUT.
AND IT COMES OUT IN DARK PLACES.
YOU BEGIN TO BELIEVE THAT IT IS SHAMEFUL
BECAUSE YOU WERE ACTING, FOR ME, IN SHAMEFUL WAYS.
I MEAN, WHERE AM I HAVING SEX?
I'M HAVING SEX IN BACK ALLEYS OF ABANDONED SYNAGOGUES.
I'M HAVING SEX IN REST STOPS.
THE FACT IS MY STRAIGHT FRIENDS
WERE PICKING UP THEIR GIRLFRIENDS
IN BARS AND AT PARTIES AND DOING IT WHEREVER.
I DIDN'T HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY
TO DO IT IN PUBLIC WAYS THAT WERE HEALTHY,
THAT WERE SAFE AND THAT WERE ACCEPTED.
AND SO BY DOING IT IN SECRET CLOSETED WAYS,
I BELIEVE IT IS UNHEALTHY FOR THE PSYCHOLOGY,
IT IS UNHEALTHY FOR THE BEING
AND IT WAS UNHEALTHY FOR MY SOUL.
Dave Karsnia over tape: All right, so let's start from the beginning.
- You went in the bathroom. - I went in the bathroom.
I got in a stall, sat down
and I started to go to the bathroom.
Did our feet come together? Apparently, they did bump.
Let me be clear: I am not gay.
I never have been gay.
HE DOESN'T THINK HE'S GAY. YOU KNOW WHAT? HE'S NOT GAY.
MAYBE HE'S HOMOSEXUAL OR SOMETHING, I DON'T KNOW.
NOT "GAY" AS IN IDENTIFIED POLITICALLY WITH OUR TRIBE.
WHO KNOWS IF LARRY CRAIG IS GAY OR NOT?
BUT WHATEVER HE IS,
IT'S POSSIBLE THAT HE'S ACTUALLY PART OF US.
WE DON'T WANT HIM, BUT IT'S POSSIBLE
HE'S ACTUALLY PART OF OUR COMMUNITY.
I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY IN HIS GENERATION--
AND IT'S STILL POSSIBLE IN YOUNGER GENERATIONS--
FOR PEOPLE TO BE SO TERRIFIED INTERNALLY
OF THEIR OWN SEXUAL ORIENTATION
THAT THEY LITERALLY JUST SUPPRESS IT TO SUCH AN EXTENT,
THAT THEY CAN'T EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE IT WHILE ACTING AS IT.
ARE YOU TECHNICALLY NOT A HOMOSEXUAL?
IS IT POSSIBLE YOU'RE BISEXUAL?
IT'S NO TO BOTH.
THE OTHER QUESTION IS DO YOU THINK
IT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE AWFUL?
IN OTHER WORDS, DO YOU VIEW IT AS SOMETHING
THAT WOULD BE AWFUL TO HAVE TO ADMIT
THAT YOU WERE GAY?
I DON'T AGREE WITH THE LIFESTYLE.
AND I'VE SAID SO BY MY VOTES OVER THE YEARS.
I THINK THAT FOR A LOT OF GAY PEOPLE
WHO MAY HARBOR SOME VERY, VERY DEEP
INTERNALIZED HOMOPHOBIA,
ONE OF THE WAYS THAT THEY FEEL BETTER ABOUT THEMSELVES
IS BY ALIGNING THEMSELVES WITH THE FORCES
THAT MIGHT ACTUALLY WANT TO DO HARM TO THEM.
AS A TEENAGER, I WAS LABELED A FAG.
AND WHAT I WOULD DO
IN ORDER TO BATTLE THAT AND FIGHT THAT
WAS I WOULD JOIN UP WITH THE OTHER GUYS
WHO WOULD BASH OTHER GAY BOYS
TO PROVE THAT "HEY, I'M NOT A FAG. I'LL EVEN BEAT UP ONE."
AND THAT, GOING BACK, IS REALLY WHAT WE SEE TODAY
IN SO MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE IN CONGRESS
VOTING AGAINST GAY PEOPLE.
IT'S THE SAME THING I WAS DOING AS A TEENAGER.
THEY ARE BASHING OTHER GAY PEOPLE
IN ORDER TO PROVE THAT THEY'RE NOT GAY.
I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING IN HISTORY
THAT-- WHERE DEEPLY ANTI- OR HOMOPHOBIC ACTIVITIES
HAVEN'T BEEN AT SOME LEVEL PERPETUATED OR FOSTERED
BY PEOPLE WHO WERE GAY.
LOOK AT McCARTHYISM AND THE WITCH HUNTS--
LED BY A CLOSETED GAY: ROY COHN, A TRUE EVIL BASTARD.
THE TARGET GROUPS OF WITCH HUNTS
AND PROSECUTION
WERE COMMUNISTS AND QUEERS.
ROY COHN SUPPORTED LOTS OF REALLY DREADFUL PEOPLE
WHO WERE COMPLETELY HOMOPHOBIC,
AND IN SOME WAYS WAS HIMSELF HOMOPHOBIC.
HE HAD A LOT OF NEGATIVE FEELINGS
ABOUT OUT GAY PEOPLE.
ROY COHN IS NOT A HOMOSEXUAL.
ROY COHN IS A HETEROSEXUAL MAN, HENRY,
WHO FUCKS AROUND WITH GUYS.
I HAD TO TAKE MY BEST SHOT
AT TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW THAT COGNITIVE DISSONANCE
IS NAVIGATED INSIDE OF SOMEBODY.
AND I FEEL LIKE I DID A PRETTY GOOD JOB OF IT.
I MEAN, THE SCENE THAT EVERYBODY LOVES BEST IS WHEN HE'S DIAGNOSED WITH AIDS
AND HE SAYS TO HIS DOCTOR, "I'M NOT A GAY MAN."
NOW TO SOMEONE WHO DOES NOT UNDERSTAND THIS,
HOMOSEXUAL IS WHAT I AM BECAUSE I HAVE SEX WITH MEN,
BUT REALLY THIS IS WRONG.
HOMOSEXUALS ARE NOT MEN WHO SLEEP WITH OTHER MEN.
HOMOSEXUALS ARE MEN WHO IN 15 YEARS OF TRYING
CANNOT PASS A PISSANT ANTIDISCRIMINATION BILL THROUGH CITY COUNCIL.
HOMOSEXUALS ARE MEN WHO KNOW NOBODY
AND WHO NOBODY KNOWS,
WHO HAVE ZERO CLOUT.
THAT RATIONALE GOES SOMETHING LIKE THIS--
IT TOOK ME AWHILE TO FIGURE IT OUT--
BUT IT WAS SORT OF LIKE, "RICH, YOU ARE A WEAK GAY
BECAUSE YOU CAME OUT. I AM A STRONGER PERSON
BECAUSE I REMAIN NOT PART OF A GAY LIBERAL COMMUNITY.
I AM STILL A CONSERVATIVE.
I AM EVERYTHING I WANT. I DON'T PUSH MY AGENDA ON ANYONE.
STRAIGHTS DON'T PUSH THEIR SEXUAL LIVES. WHY SHOULD WE?"
AND IT'S VERY-- I'VE HEARD THIS A MILLION TIMES,
AND IT'S VERY WARPED.
BUT IT WAS SORT OF LIKE, "YOU COULDN'T HAVE THE STAMINA
TO STAY IN THE CLOSET."
THEY'RE VERY CAREFUL. IT'S LIKE A BROADWAY SHOW.
POLITICS IS LIKE A BROADWAY SHOW TO THEM
IN THAT EVERYTHING IS STAGED, EVERYTHING IS PLANNED,
EVERY WORD THAT COMES OUT OF SOMEBODY'S MOUTH IS SCRIPTED.
Today is a special day in my life.
It's not just Valentine's Day.
It happens to be the anniversary of the first date
I had with my wife Suzanne.
Am I a romantic? Well, maybe just a little bit.
Even after the Craigs got married
and he adopted her three children from a previous marriage,
the rumors about her husband persisted.
THEY WERE SAYING THAT IT WAS A MARRIAGE OF CONVENIENCE.
TO COVER A GAY LIFESTYLE?
OH, GIVE ME A BREAK.
I KNOW WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY IN PUBLIC
AND I ACTUALLY KIND OF ADMIRE 'EM
FOR BEING ABLE TO GIVE THAT PERFORMANCE.
I'M SURE I COULDN'T.
UH, BUT THAT'S SOME WEIRD SHIT.
PEOPLE KNOW ME
AND KNOW THAT I WOULD NEVER DO THAT.
THAT'S ALMOST LIKE SELLING YOUR SOUL FOR SOMETHING.NO!
WHERE DO YOU FIND THE SPOUSES
OF THESE PEOPLE WHO STICK WITH THEM?
I MEAN, THAT IS SO BIZARRE. HOW DO YOU STAND NEXT TO YOUR HUSBAND
AFTER HE'S BEEN IN A STALL?
I MEAN, I WOULD HAVE BEEN GOING TO--
I'D HAVE HEADED TO A SHOWER FOR A "SILKWOOD" SCRUBDOWN
OR CERTAINLY TO AN STD CLINIC.
I WOULDN'T BE AT THE WHISTLE-STOP CAFE
STANDING BY HIM.
IS SHE INSANE?
WHAT INTERESTS ME MORE AND I THINK WHAT IS MORE COMMON
ARE THESE STRAIGHT WOMEN WHO ARE MARRIED
TO CLOSETED GAY MEN WHO DON'T KNOW.
I engaged in an adult consensual affair
with another man
which violates my bonds of matrimony.
I DATED JIM FOR FOUR YEARS BEFORE WE WERE MARRIED,
SO I THOUGHT I KNEW HIM.
PEOPLE ALWAYS SAY, "OH, THERE HAD TO BE SIGNS."
I HAD TO KNOW THIS WAS AN ARRANGED MARRIAGE.
OUR SEX LIFE, OUR RELATIONSHIP-- THERE WAS NOTHING--
OUR INTIMACY-- THERE WAS NOTHING TO INDICATE THAT THERE WAS A PROBLEM.
I HAD NEVER BEEN MARRIED BEFORE
SO I COULDN'T COMPARE IT TO ANOTHER MARRIAGE.
BUT FROM TALKING TO FRIENDS AND FAMILY,
IT WAS A NORMAL RELATIONSHIP.
IF YOU'RE KEEPING A DOUBLE LEDGER
FROM THE SECOND OF YOUR MORNING BREATH
TO THE TIME YOU GO TO BED AT NIGHT,
IT'S LIKE A BAD "STAR TREK" EPISODE-- YOU HAVE TO DISCERN
WHICH FOOT IS IN WHICH UNIVERSE AT ANY GIVEN TIME.
YOU'RE PLAYING IN A PARALLEL UNIVERSE,
BUT IT'S NOT INTEGRATED, IT'S NOT HONEST,
IT'S NOT WHOLESOME AND IT'S NOT TRANSPARENT.
NONE OF THAT WAS REAL.
NONE OF THOSE FEELINGS OF THOSE EMOTIONS
WERE REAL FROM HIS PERSPECTIVE. IT WAS ALL AN ACT.
WHAT PART OF MY LIFE AND MY MARRIAGE WAS REAL?
WAS THAT TRIP REAL? WAS THAT VACATION REAL?
WHAT ABOUT IT WAS AUTHENTIC?
IF YOUR HUSBAND LEAVES YOU FOR ANOTHER WOMAN
OR IF YOUR WIFE LEAVES YOU FOR ANOTHER MAN,
AT SOME POINT YOU HAD FEELINGS FOR EACH OTHER
SO AT SOME POINT THERE WAS LOVE.
IN MY CASE, I DON'T THINK HE EVER FELT THAT FOR ME.
THERE WERE MOMENTS OF PASSION,
BUT AT THAT POINT,
I WASN'T READY TO ACCEPT EVEN WHO AND WHAT I AM.
SO TO BE TOTALLY OPEN WITH HER,
I WOULD HAVE HAD TO ACCEPT MYSELF
AND THEN SHARE IT WITH SOMEBODY I LOVED.
TO A CERTAIN POINT THEY ARE THE VICTIM,
BUT THEY MADE THEIR OWN CHOICES
ABOUT HOW THEY WERE GONNA LIVE THEIR LIVES.
God the Father, God the Son,
God the Holy Spirit, bless, preserve and keep you.
WHEN I THINK, IT HAD TO BE TORTURE
FOR HIM TO GO THROUGH LIFE TRYING TO LIVE AS SOMEONE
HE CLEARLY WASN'T COMFORTABLE BEING...
...BUT HE DIDN'T HAVE TO DESTROY MY LIFE
OR MY DAUGHTER'S LIFE OR ANYBODY ELSE'S LIFE.
It was wrong. It was foolish.
It was inexcusable.
And for this, I ask the forgiveness
and the grace of my wife.
She has been extraordinary throughout this ordeal...
I'VE BEEN PRIVILEGED TO SERVE PEOPLE
OF THIS GREAT STATE WE CALL FLORIDA.
SHE IS THE STATE WITH THE PRETTIEST NAME
AND I LOVE HER.
Testing testing, one two three.
At first glance, Kelly Crosby Heyniger
seems like a typical suburban mom,
but what makes her unique is the company she keeps.
He's a great guy,
a lot of fun. He's real.
He wants to make a difference.
"He" is Florida Governor Charlie Crist.
Kelly was set up on a date with him for a charity event
on Jupiter Island several months ago.
YOU'D ACTUALLY WANT RUMORS.
I MEAN, I'D GO TO GO-GO BARS WITH MY BUDDIES.
MY GAY FRIENDS SAID AFTERWARDS,
"WHAT DID YOU DO FOR THOSE HOURS?"
We have a good relationship. I enjoy his company
and I think he enjoys mine too,
but I don't like to project.
I WOULD SORT OF PARSE WORDS WHEN PEOPLE WOULD CONFRONT ME,
"OH, I HEAR RUMORS THAT YOU'RE GAY."
I'M LIKE, "OH, THAT'S CRAZY."
"YOU'RE A HOMOSEXUAL?" "NO, THAT'S ABSURD.
THERE'S RUMORS ABOUT EVERYBODY IN POLITICS." SO YOU'D BE DISMISSIVE.
Charlie, let me ask you this:
- Are you a homo?
Okay, I didn't think so.
I can attest
because I've seen you with some great-looking women. I go...
Rumors that Crist is gay have been printed
in alternative newspapers and online. He denies it.
And Kelly doesn't give that speculation a second thought.
Do people say stuff to you about that?
Mm, they do,
but when you put yourself in front of the public eye,
someone is always gonna have something negative to say,
whether it be true or not.
THE CLOSET FOR ME IN THE CONTEXT OF POWER POLITICS
IS ACTUALLY QUITE DANGEROUS.
I THINK IT DEEPLY CONVOLUTES YOUR PERSPECTIVE
ON WHAT'S RIGHT AND WHAT'S WRONG.
I THINK IT MAKES YOU LESS GENUINE.
I THINK PEOPLE WHO ARE CLOSETED AND INVOLVED IN POLITICS
ARE INTERESTED IN CONTINUALLY COVERING UP
WHO THEY ARE AND WHAT THEY ARE,
WHICH I THINK DELIVERS A VERY NEGATIVE PUBLIC POLICY.
YOU KNOW, IN 1976,
GERRY FORD AND JIMMY CARTER WERE ABOUT EVEN ON GAY RIGHTS.
SINCE THEN THE DEMOCRATS HAVE GOTTEN BETTER
AND THE REPUBLICANS CAPTURED BY THE RIGHT WING HAVE GOTTEN WORSE.
STARTING IN THE EARLY '70s,
JOE COORS AND A NUMBER OF PEOPLE
PAID JUSTICE LEWIS POWELL BEFORE HE WAS ON THE SUPREME COURT
TO WRITE WHAT WE CALL "THE POWELL MANIFESTO."
NOW IT'S BASICALLY A CONCRETE BUSINESS PLAN
ON HOW TO ENSURE FREE ENTERPRISE IN PERPETUITY.
AND WITH WHAT WE CALL THE NINE FAMILIES--
THE BRADLEYS, THE SCAIFES, THE OLINS, THE COORS--
THIS HUGE MACHINE WAS BUILT:
MEDIA MONITORS AND JUDICIAL WATCHES
AND ELEGANT LEADERSHIP DEVELOPMENT PROGRAMS
AND THINK TANKS THAT COME UP WITH ISSUES
THAT WILL PANDER TO CERTAIN VOTERS.
AND WHAT POPPED UP FOR THEM
LIKE A GIFT WAS GAY MARRIAGE.
AND THEY WENT, "EUREKA!
THIS IS WHAT WE'LL USE."
God, as California goes, so goes the nation.
A confrontation between light and darkness
will happen this November.
A battle to save the very sanctity of marriage.
To the victor goes the soul of the nation!
These gays is going to hell!
This abomination in the sight of God--
This is what the homosexuals can do.
They don't really care about how much they destroy.
WE SHOULD NOT LET 2% OF THE POPULATION
DETERMINE-- TO CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF MARRIAGE
THAT HAS BEEN SUPPORTED BY EVERY SINGLE CULTURE
AND EVERY SINGLE RELIGION FOR 5,000 YEARS.
RIGHT NOW THE REPUBLICAN PARTY AND THE RELIGIOUS RIGHT
ARE IN AN UNHOLY ALLIANCE POLITICALLY.
AND I THINK THEIR UNHOLY ALLIANCE
HAS BEEN LARGELY FOCUSED
ON THIS NOTION OF BEING HOMOPHOBIC.
In America the only marriage to be recognized
is the marriage between a man and a woman!
I SAW IT COMING
IN THE FALL OF '03
WITH THE MASSACHUSETTS COURT RULING
WITH A CLOSE ELECTION. I SAW IT COMING.
I REMEMBER THE DAY
THAT PRESIDENT BUSH GOT UP AND HELD THE NEWS CONFERENCE
ANNOUNCING HIS SUPPORT FOR THE AMENDMENT.
Marriage cannot be severed
from its cultural, religious and natural roots.
SEEING THE PRESIDENT ANNOUNCING
THAT ONE OF HIS TOP PRIORITIES IN CONGRESS
WAS TO PREVENT ME AND MY PARTNER
FROM HAVING A LEGITIMATE RELATIONSHIP,
THAT WAS A POWERFUL THING.
IT'S A VERY SURREAL EXPERIENCE
TO WATCH THE STATE OF THE UNION ADDRESS
AND HAVE THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
ATTACK YOU AND DEMONIZE YOU IN THAT SPEECH
THAT'S BEING WATCHED BY THE ENTIRE WORLD.
IT JUST MADE YOU SICK.
IT REALLY IN MANY WAYS WAS A GUT CHECK FOR ME.
I THINK IT WAS FOR A LOT OF OTHER GAY REPUBLICANS TOO.
I WAS JUST FURIOUS. I FELT BETRAYED. I FELT ANGRY.
I GUESS IF I BELIEVED
THAT IT WAS A SINCERE PERSONAL CONVICTION,
I MIGHT HAVE FELT DIFFERENTLY ABOUT IT.
BUT TO JUST USE THAT TO GET MORE VOTES...
THIS WAS JUST RAW POLITICS.
THE PRESIDENT DIDN'T NEED TO DO THIS TO GET RE-ELECTED.
I THINK THE FEDERAL MARRIAGE AMENDMENT
WAS THE MOST VIOLENT ATTACK UPON GAY PEOPLE AND THEIR RIGHTS
IN THIS COUNTRY, EXPLICITLY, THAT'S EVER HAPPENED.
I cannot think of a better good
that this body may pursue
than to promote and defend the idea
that every child deserves both a father and a mother.
EVERY ACT OF VIOLENCE AGAINST GAY OR LESBIAN, BISEXUAL, TRANSGENDER PEOPLE
USUALLY STARTS WITH SOME FORM OF VERY VISIBLE AND VERY LOUD DEFAMATION.
Anywhere in the world today,
you can wake somebody up in the middle of the night,
you pick 'em, and say, "Excuse me. Wake up just a second.
What is a marriage?"
And they'll say, "A union between a man and a woman."
SO YOU HAVE THESE ANTI-GAY LEADERS THAT ARE SPEWING ALL THIS HATRED
ABOUT GAY AND LESBIAN PEOPLE.
AND PEOPLE WHO AREN'T REALLY ENGAGED
AND DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON AND DON'T FOLLOW IT THAT MUCH
HAVE A GENERAL SAME VIEWPOINT AS THEM
AND THEY JUST SORT OF COPY AND THEY MIRROR IT. AND THAT'S HOW IT TRANSFORMS.
A charred truck, threats,
"I'll be back," and in bigger writing
for everyone to see: "Gay must go."
22-year-old James Nichola who goes by "Janine"
says he was the victim of a hate crime.
He says the attackers the whole time were yelling,
"We want you out of our neighborhood!"
San Jose, California: Bill Kiley suffered
repeated harassment from a young neighbor.
This is video of Neve in the hospital
just a few days after he was brutally attacked.
He spent several days in Strong Hospital
with a fractured skull, nose, upper jaw and eye socket.
On May 29, the 18-year-old victim's body
is discovered in the woods behind his family's Woodlawn home.
Police say Steven Parrish had joined a Bloods gang
and was killed by two members of his own group.
Court documents say it's because they thought he was gay.
That was four days before his graduation from Randallstown High School.
Students marched in Oxnard, California,
in memory of Lawrence "Larry" King,
a 15-year-old student police say was gunned down by a classmate
because he was openly gay. 14-year-old Brandon McInerney
allegedly shot King in the head in the school's computer lab.
It's over.
King was pronounced brain-dead at a local hospital.
His body was kept alive so his organs could be donated.
Today I call upon the Congress to promptly pass
and to send to the states for ratification
an amendment to our Constitution
defining and protecting marriage as the union of a man and woman
as husband and wife.
DIRECTLY UNDERNEATH THE 2004 STRATEGY
AROUND ANTI-GAY ELEMENTS OF THE BUSH CAMPAIGN,
YOU WILL FIND A CADRE OF GAY PEOPLE.
THE 2004 ELECTION WAS A VERY ANTI-GAY--
YOU KNOW, IT WAS A PARTY.
AND KEN MEHLMAN WAS LIKE THE M.C.
Lifestyle issues. Gay marriage.
Is that an issue in this campaign?
I think it's an issue in many races.
IT WAS HARD BECAUSE THERE WASN'T THE KIND OF EVIDENCE
WITH KEN MEHLMAN THAT THERE WAS WITH OTHER PEOPLE,
BUT IT WAS RELATIVELY KNOWN, AND NOBODY WOULD EVEN ASK.
A lot of the chiefs of staff,
the people who really run the underpinnings
of the Republican party are gay.
I don't want to mention names, but I will Friday night.
You will Friday night?
Well, there's a couple of big people who I think everyone in Washington knows
- who run the-- - You will name them?
Well, I wouldn't be the first.
I'd get sued if I was the first.
Ken Mehlman, there's one I think people have talked about.
I don't think he's denied it when people have suggested it.
- He doesn't say-- - I'm walking around in a fog.
- Come on. - Ken Mehlman? I never heard that.
- But the question is-- - Maybe you don't go to the same bathhouse I do.
I'd get sued if I was the first.
Maybe you don't go to the same bathhouse I do.
Why would someone who is gay
take public anti-gay positions?
Why would you do that?
Because, Larry, hating yourself is the greatest love of all.
KEN MEHLMAN WAS THE GUY THAT RAN THE CAMPAIGN
THAT WAS SENDING OUT THESE FLIERS,
THAT WAS BAITING PEOPLE, THAT WAS--
PARTICULARLY IN OHIO AND ALL THESE BATTLEGROUND STATES
WHERE IT WAS ALL ABOUT "LET'S GET PEOPLE TO VOTE FOR BUSH
BY THIS GAY THING" LED BY THE GAY GUY!
AND FUNDED BY THE GAY GUY!
AND POLITICALLY DIRECTED BY THE GAY GUY!
YOU KNOW? AND I THINK PEOPLE DESERVE TO KNOW THAT.
I THINK MARY CHENEY'S OUTING WAS EFFECTIVE.
OH, I'M APPALLED BY THE CHENEYS.
I FELT EXTREMELY DISHEARTENED...
THAT THEY WERE AS SUPPORTIVE OF THE ANTI-GAY POLICIES AS THEY WERE.
WE ALWAYS THOUGHT WE HAD SOME PROTECTION
BECAUSE OF THE VICE PRESIDENT'S DAUGHTER.
If your father was not the vice president,
and you were a gay woman in a gay relationship
in the United States in 2004, 2000,
- would you have voted for this ticket? - Yes, I would have.
IF SHE WERE STRIPPED OF HER FATHER'S TITLE,
SHE WOULD BE SUBJECTED TO THE SAME GRATUITOUS DISCRIMINATION
THAT AFFECTS SO MANY GAYS AND LESBIANS IN THIS COUNTRY.
SHE IS PROTECTED BY HER POSITION AND HER MONEY.
- And you have a partner. - I do.
"Gay couples cannot file jointly for federal taxes." Is that true?
- That is true. - And your feelings about that?
I think it's wrong. I think they should be able to.
Did you talk to your father about this?
We have many conversations about different issues.
Maybe that's the point.
I'm wondering if people would rather
you had talked about it during the campaign
as opposed to after the campaign and putting it in the book.
Would it have been more effective to talk about it then?
I honestly don't think it would have been.
I'M COMPLETELY UNIMPRESSED
THAT SHE DOESN'T AGREE WITH PRESIDENT BUSH
OR HER FATHER DICK CHENEY,
WHEN IN FACT SHE WORKED,
SHE WAS A PAID OPERATIVE
TO GET THEM ELECTED AND THEN RE-ELECTED.
MARY CHENEY'S JOB BEFORE HER FATHER RAN FOR PRESIDENT
WAS TO BE THE GAY AND LESBIAN LIAISON FOR COORS BEER.
SHE MADE HER LIVING FIGURING OUT
HOW TO DISSECT THE GAY COMMUNITY
INTO NICHE MARKETS AND SELL THEM COORS BEER.
BUT SHE WASN'T INQUISITIVE ENOUGH
AND DIDN'T CARE ENOUGH
TO DISSECT THE REPUBLICAN PARTY
AND THE ELITE OF THAT PARTY
TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET BASIC RIGHTS PASSED.
THERE IS PROBABLY NOT A BETTER EXAMPLE
OF SOMEONE WHO IS SO STEEPED
IN HYPOCRISY.
SHE COULD HAVE MADE A HUGE DIFFERENCE
AND DID NOT.
I GOT A CALL FROM A GOOD FRIEND OF MINE
WHO TOLD ME THERE WAS A GAY ACTIVIST
WHO WAS GOING TO START A BLOG
AND WAS GONNA START OUTING REPUBLICANS.
DURING THIS TIME, I WAS THE NATIONAL FIELD DIRECTOR
OF THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE.
ONE OF THE BIG RESPONSIBILITIES THAT I HAD
WAS HELPING TO OVERSEE A DIRECT-MAIL PROGRAM.
I WAS THE FIRST ONE TO GET A PAMPHLET
FROM AN ARKANSAS READER OF MY BLOG
THAT SAID THE DEMOCRATS WERE GONNA BAN THEIR BIBLE
AND TURN STATES INTO BASTIONS OF HOMOSEXUALITY.
AND THEY WERE SENDING THIS TO CHURCH PEW ROSTERS AROUND THE COUNTRY.
IT WAS SENT BY THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE
AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN TRY TO HIDE IT!
DAN GURLEY WHO HAD ULTIMATE AUTHORITY
OVER THESE UNBELIEVABLE FLIERS, HE HAD A PROFILE ON GAY.COM
THAT WAS STASHED FULL OF A BUNCH OF HIS PICTURES.
AND HE WAS SEEKING MULTIPLE PARTNERS FOR SEX.
I GOT A CALL FROM HIM AT HOME ONE SUNDAY NIGHT
SAYING, "YOU'RE THE ONE. YOU'RE GONNA BE NEXT."
HE POINTEDLY ASKED ME IF I WAS A GAY MAN.
AND I TOLD HIM THAT I WAS.
UH, HE...
IMMEDIATELY THEN STARTED TO...
TO QUESTION ME ABOUT DID I NOT HAVE A CONSCIENCE?
DID I NOT FEEL SOME SORT OF REMORSE
OR REGRET FOR WORKING FOR A POLITICAL PARTY,
WORKING TO HELP ELECT A PRESIDENT
THAT DID NOT SUPPORT EQUAL RIGHTS FOR GAY AMERICANS?
I BASICALLY JUST SAID, YOU KNOW,
"YOU DO WHAT YOU FEEL LIKE YOU THINK YOU HAVE TO DO."
I WAS IN LINE FOR A PRESIDENTIAL APPOINTMENT,
IN ALL LIKELIHOOD IN SOME POLICY ROLE SOMEWHERE.
BUT ONCE ROGERS DID THIS POSTING ABOUT ME
THAT OPPORTUNITY EVAPORATED.
RECENTLY I GET AN EMAIL--
"DAN GURLEY'S ON THE BOARD
OF NORTH CAROLINA EQUALITY." I'M LIKE, "WHAT?"
I WENT TO THE WEBSITE, I LOOKED IT ABOUT,
AND I'M LIKE, "THIS IS HOT.
THIS IS WHY I STARTED BLOGACTIVE."
HE'S AN OUT GAY MAN AND HE'S PROUD
AND HE'S ON THE BOARD OF A STATEWIDE NATIONAL GAY GROUP.
THIS MAN IS USING HIS SKILL TO SECURE GAY RIGHTS.
WHAT COULD BE BETTER AND WHAT BETTER EFFECT
COULD I HAVE AS AN INDIVIDUAL?
WHEN YOU COME OUT, I GUARANTEE YOU
THE EXPERIENCE WILL BE BETTER THAN YOU EVER DREAMED IT WOULD BE.
IN A SENSE I CAME OUT, I GUESS YOU MIGHT SAY, IN STAGES.
I LEFT A MARRIAGE BACK IN 1991
AND THAT WAS A BIG STEP FOR ME.
I RECOGNIZED MYSELF AND HER--
WHAT THE FEELINGS THAT I HAD.
JULY OF '96 WAS WHEN WE HAD A VOTE
ON WHAT WAS CALLED D.O.M.A., THE DEFENSE OF MARRIAGE ACT.
AND I VOTED FOR THAT.
AT THAT TIME "THE ADVOCATE" MAGAZINE DECIDED THEY WOULD WRITE AN ARTICLE.
AND APPROACHED ME ABOUT IT AND TOLD ME THEY WERE GOING TO DO SO
AND NAME ME AS ONE WHO WAS GAY.
AND I BASICALLY JUST SAID,
WELL, I THOUGHT THAT WAS WRONG FOR THEM TO DO THAT.
I SAID, "I'LL BEAT YOU TO THE PUNCH HERE." AND I JUST DID IT MYSELF.
IT WAS PROBABLY THE MOST LIFTING EXPERIENCE I'VE EVER HAD.
I HAD THIS UNBELIEVABLE, INDESCRIBABLE
SENSE OF PEACE AND CALM COME OVER ME.
AND I COULD LITERALLY LITERALLY FEEL
40 YEARS JUST LIFTING OFF OF MY SHOULDER.
I'LL NEVER FORGET WHEN I DID MY ANNOUNCEMENT SPEECH.
MY MOTHER HAD FOUND SOME PRAYER CARDS FROM MY GRANDMOTHER,
FOR WHOM I WAS VERY CLOSE TO.
AND I REMEMBER GOING INTO THE BATHROOM
JUST OUTSIDE THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE.
AND, UM...
PRAYING TO MY GRANDMOTHER.
AND SAYING TO HER...
"AT LONG LAST...
THIS IS WHO GOD MADE ME
AND THIS IS A GOOD THING."
I ALWAYS REMEMBER JOHN McCAIN.
WHEN I STARTED TO SAY, "JOHN, THERE'S SOMETHING
I REALLY WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT AND TELL YOU ABOUT."
HE JUST PUT UP HIS HAND AND SAID, "NEVER MIND, JIM. I KNOW.
IT DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. YOU'RE A GOOD LEGISLATOR.
YOU'VE ALWAYS BEEN AND YOU'RE ALWAYS GOING TO BE MY FRIEND."
AND I REMEMBER WALKING AWAY FROM THAT CONVERSATION THINKING,
"GOSH, THAT WAS PRETTY EASY. THAT WASN'T VERY TOUGH TO DO THAT."
AND SO EACH ONE WAS KIND OF LIKE THAT.
AND IT GOT SO I JUST COULDN'T WAIT TO PICK UP THE PHONE TO MAKE THE NEXT CALL.
I THINK IN THE CASE OF A MEMBER OF CONGRESS,
THEY DO CHANGE THEIR VOTING RECORD.
BECAUSE ONCE YOU'RE OUT OF THE CLOSET,
YOUR DELUSIONAL THINKING FALLS BY THE WAYSIDE.
The gentleman is recognized for three minutes.
Mr. Speaker, we have not used the amending process
to limit the rights of citizens. From the First Amendment to the 14th,
the original framers in the Congress that followed
have sought to expand, to protect the rights of citizens.
This would be a unique amendment in that it takes away rights from one group
while specifically conferring it upon another.
Try to find another provision in the Constitution
that does this. You will look in vain.
Mr. Speaker, this Congress and those after it should
be about protecting and expanding freedoms.
This proposed amendment to our Constitution is about discrimination.
It is about fear. It is unnecessary,
it is unwarranted and it should be soundly defeated.
Amendment 2 does only one thing:
defining marriage as a union of a man and a woman.
That's it. When you vote,
say yes to pass life to the next generation.
Vote yes to keep marriage one man, one woman.
That's it. No one loses benefits.
Please vote yes on Amendment 2.
A big political announcement out of Florida tonight.
Republican presidential candidate John McCain
has picked up a major endorsement.
I don't think anybody would do better than the man who stands next to me: Senator John McCain.
Governor Crist, just real quickly, are they chatting with you
about a possible V.P. slot for you? Come on, be shameless.
- Tell us. - We're chatting about working hard for Florida.
Crist has obviously coveted the vice-presidential spot
- on the Republican ticket. - Chris Matthews: "Try getting married,"
is that what we're hearing this week? Is this part of the excitement
and the build-up to running for V.P.? What's going on here?
If your wife can't help you in a campaign, who can?
The state's most eligible bachelor is officially off the market
this Fourth of July. Governor Charlie Crist is engaged.
He popped the question yesterday to his girlfriend of nine months.
Her name is Carole Rome.
Let me start by asking you what made you decide
to pop the question when you did and, you know?
Well, I mean, I think you pop the question like that
when you're in love and I am.
And so that's why I did it.
And thank God she said yes.
We couldn't be happier.
I TELL THEM TO NEVER LIE, THAT IF THEY GET THE QUESTION
THEY SHOULD BE PREPARED TO ANSWER THE QUESTION HONESTLY
AND DO NOTHING BUT ANSWER THE QUESTION HONESTLY.
What's your reaction over some people's preoccupation,
and I'm not talking this time about marriage,
with your sexuality? Both the rumors of-- you know,
the various rumors that have been around?
Sure. Well, you know, when you're in the public eye,
being Governor of Florida, that's inevitable.
And, you know, I just-- I don't really focus on it.
I'm just, uh, you know,
damn glad to-- I found such a wonderful lady.
THE SAD THING ABOUT THE CLOSET IS IT DOES, IN PART,
GIVE YOU SKILLS THAT YOU CAN APPLY AS A POLITICIAN,
BECAUSE SO MUCH OF POLITICS TODAY IS POSITIONING
AND SPINNING AND BEING ABLE TO PIROUETTE ON AN ISSUE.
One aspect is that you were gay.
The other one is that you were a serial philandering heterosexual.
Does that bother you?
Uh, well, lack of truth always would be disturbing to somebody.
But I'm just pleased that I found happiness.
I'VE WATCHED DECENT PEOPLE STRUGGLE WITH COMING OUT
AND BEING UNABLE TO DO SO.
THE CLOSET, PARTICULARLY IN THE MIDST OF A CULTURAL WAR,
SUFFOCATES THE INTEGRITY OF DECENT PEOPLE.
"For this reason, a man will leave his father and mother
and be united with his wife
and they will become one flesh."
For God's design.
On November 4th, vote yes on Amendment 2.
With laws already on the books to ban same-sex marriage in Florida,
voters now added that ban to the State Constitution.
OH, WITHOUT A DOUBT. WITHOUT A DOUBT THE GOVERNOR
OF FLORIDA COULD HAVE CHANGED THE OUTCOME OF THAT ELECTION
HAD HE NOT TILTED TO THE RIGHT AND DECIDED TO TAKE THE POSITION THAT HE DID.
YEAH, WITHOUT A DOUBT.
THE ROAD TO HELL IS PAVED WITH GOOD INTENTIONS.
BECAUSE YOU THINK YOU'RE DOING THE RIGHT THING. AND DAMN IT,
YOU KNOW WHAT THE RIGHT VALUE IS? THE RIGHT VALUE IS TRUTHFULNESS.
THE RIGHT VALUE IS HONESTY.
THE RIGHT VALUE ISN'T LIVING SOMEBODY ELSE'S TRUTH.
IT'S LIVING YOUR TRUTH.
WE DON'T HAVE RIGHTS.
GAY PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE RIGHTS.
DON'T TELL ME THAT WE DO.
THAT'S WHY IT'S SO IMPORTANT
THAT WE KNOW ABOUT THESE PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS
IN PEOPLE'S LIVES. IT AFFECTS GOVERNMENT.
IT AFFECTS EVERYTHING.
THIS WHOLE ISSUE REALLY DOES IMPACT THE PUBLIC-POLICY ARENA.
IT AFFECTS SOME OF OUR NATION'S MOST SIGNIFICANT
AND POWERFUL INDIVIDUALS AND IT'S WHY
MY HOPE IS THAT THIS NEXT GENERATION
OF YOUNG AMERICAN LEADERS DOESN'T HAVE TO BE SUFFOCATED
IN THE MIDST OF A CULTURAL WAR THAT HOPEFULLY HAS ENDED
BY THE TIME THEY REACH WASHINGTON, D.C.
I REALLY DO BELIEVE, AND I'VE ALWAYS FELT THIS,
THAT THE MOST IMPORTANT THING A GAY PERSON CAN DO
WITH RESPECT TO THE SOCIAL-JUSTICE ISSUES AROUND HOMOSEXUALITY
IS SIMPLY TO BE OUT.
AND IT STAGGERS ME TODAY THAT SO MANY ARE NOT.
IF EVERY GAY PERSON WERE TO COME OUT OF THE CLOSET,
THE GAY RIGHTS MOVEMENT WOULD BE OVER.
THAT'S THE SLEEPING GIANT OF THE MOVEMENT--
IS ALL THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THE CLOSET COMING OUT
EN MASSE AND IT WOULD BE DONE.
If every gay person in this state
came out-- came out to their family, their friends,
we would win.
But that means that every gay person must come out
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